Completed Textures

[DieHard SCWS]

Ok i got the first texture done

Its not an really interesting one, but still an important one. And this one i could create frome recycling the already used one in the S3TC textures.


This is as far as i could find, the only texture that has a missalignment.

It does fix the lights used in tons of maps. Like in this example from DmVertical+:

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TC/ExampleDmVertical%2B/02DmVertical%2BS3TCLarge.jpg

While it should look like this,( as far as alignment, not quality)

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TC/ExampleDmVertical%2B/02DmVertical%2BNormalLarge.jpg



This is the new fixed texture, and the inset (left bottom) shows the original Unreal version:

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/Light5b.jpg


I am working on more complex textures that will fix a big part of the textures used in DmSinfonia's walls which also are used for the holdingcell, they should hopefully be done next week.
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[Shambler]

Can't you just put down the drawscale to a 1/4 to get it to fit properly?

[DieHard SCWS]

Totaly correct, but........... the lamps within the texture were missaligned too, they were not centered correctly.

So i made four copys, scaled it down till 1024 x 1024 and realigned them to the middle, it all had alot more work as i am telling now, but yeah it does come down to that.
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[Shambler]

Ah glad u fixed it....around how many textures do you think are neccessary to replace?

[DieHard SCWS]

Eeeuh, some 3500 ? ? ? ?


Lol ill just see how far i get, i just work on the most important ones for now.

Or on textures that are wrong and can be repaired fairly easelly like this one.
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[DieHard SCWS]

Another S3TC fixed.

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/sh_cel4.jpg

- repaired bad tiling
- repaired shadowing


The S3TC users, look at the ceiling in DmHiddenSecretV2, great texture with some weird shadows on some places.

Oh as usual i brighten them up for a better view on the internet.
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[DieHard SCWS]

Fixed S3TC

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/Blakm_d.jpg

- slightly fixed tiling


This is a color variation on the above on, i see that often in Unreal, this one was easy to do. But in effect this is the first brandnew S3TC texture. Though easy to do in Photoshop, it looks correct there, but i never can predict how it will actually look like in Unreal.

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/Blakm31d.jpg

- new S3TC Texture
- slightly fixed tiling


Another brandnew one:

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/Bstl23c1.jpg

- new S3TC Texture
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[DieHard SCWS]

2 new S3TC textures, and these are interesting!!! One of them is the holding cell wall

But both are used in tons of maps as wall, the second one also is used widely in DmSinfonia


http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/PANELS4.jpg

- new S3TC Texture
- holding cell wall



http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/PANEL6.jpg

- new S3TC Texture
- DmSinfonia wall


As said i am also working on both lockers, used in Sinfonia, ill prob finish those today too For all these textures count, i can use parts from excisting S3TC textures.


3493 to go
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[DieHard SCWS]

Oops forgot this one, now i am not sure if this is the holdingcell, anyway its either one of them, and this one too aplies for DmSinfonia or tons of other maps.

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/Panels6.jpg

- new S3TC Texture
- holding cell wall ?
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[DieHard SCWS]

This one is used in virtually any map, the lights in the ceiling in DmDeck16 for example. Eeerm, ok, ok, ok, i still have to do the light itself , but the background is done

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/dCeilng3_2.jpg

- new S3TC Texture
- ceiling/lights in prob 50% of the maps around .
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[Hyper]

Wow, it looks like the project is igniting. I have to see map screens to really understand what's new / fixed, but it's good to see that some results are starting to come.

[DieHard SCWS]

Well, new really means new, in such case there was no S3TC version from the normal Unreal texture

The fixed ones well here is an example, the example is made out of 4 tiles. The two tiles at the top are the original S3TC textures, the two on the bottom are the fixed S3TC textures.

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/Fixed_S3TC_Example_sh_cel4.jpg

If you see these flaws ingame than it can look pretty stupid


Except for not having an Texture packingtool these few textures are already alot lol. I didn't count them, but i don't think theres much more than 60 or 80 S3TC textures, meaning i already added some 10%


If i could do the remaining would be cool but its unlikelly i can, but if i could add some 40 missing important textures than that could cover 50 to 80 % of all maps.


The real important ones are the crates (almost in any map to be found, and big eyecatchers), the elevator floors, the doors, all those together are only 12 missing textures !!!


Which indeed means, with only a few extra textures you can create the biggest part of High Resolution textures needed. I will make more though, ill see where it ends.


But i need a friggen texture packing tool and to be specific, a tool that can delete textures out of the packages, so i can replace them with the new (including the DrawScale option) textures.
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[Kerilkkorn]

For the texture packing tool, this willl be complicated, but I may find options easier to do.
For instance I could more easily convert back maybe a package from unreal2 or UT2003/2004 back to unreal.
So if you have either of these game let me know.

You could then use the new editor to create package, and I'll make a tool to convert them to unreal format.
Creating packages from scratch seems hard for the moment...

[BOZO]

I have a technical question regarding the new textures.

For the original texture packages they were able to save somewhat on performance by reutilizing the same palette for multiple different textures in a package.

I know they used the Epic written texture compression program Bright to do all of this.

I am guessing you are not reutilizing the same old palettes? Are we still going to be able to combine texture palettes for the new STC3 textures?

[DieHard SCWS]

Kerilk and BOZO i moved my answers to the packer tool topic:

http://www.oldunreal.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=S3TC;action=display;num=1112156250

In that way this post stays on topic, please read and reply there.
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[Hyper]

Nice fixes! I never worried about the texure alignment problems, but now I see how much it can improve I'm getting very interested.

But I still wonder how high-res versions of low-res textures can be made when you don't have any hi-res source material. That sounds almost impossible to me.

For example: an interestin texture is/are the skybox mountain textures. These are in an ugly low resolution, even compared to Unreal's original textures. But probably hard to produce.

[DieHard SCWS]

Code: Select all

But I still wonder how high-res versions of low-res textures can be made when you don't have any hi-res source material.

I will have to make them from scratch is the answer, and it is possible, but yeah very very difficult indeed. And some textures probably can be made fairly easy, but some others are incredible complicated.


Here are 3 examples of S3TC textures that already were in the UT packages. They definatelly are one of the best i found.

A door:
http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/S3TCExamples/VDoor3.jpg


Some pipes:
http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/S3TCExamples/MPIPES5.jpg


A wall:
http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/S3TCExamples/ext_sdwl.jpg


That door is certainly a goal what i want to reach, that one is simply awsome, but it contains tons of techniques, which i do not all master(yet). The pipes, i will go try do them very soon, the same goes for wires, they probably are relative easy to do.


Thusfar i have not looked at the skylines, i have not tried any techniques for those, at this moment i am trying to do all textures that already have an excisting master texture i can work from.


For example i found that the DmDeck16 wall with the pipes on top is the base that is used for 3 other textures. That is the best i can have, the master texture, any other variation simply has a layer painted over it.

This is the master texture:
http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/S3TCExamples/dWallB2.jpg

These are the 3 not yet S3TC variations:
http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/S3TCExamples/dB1Goop.jpg

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/S3TCExamples/dB1GoopA.jpg

http://www.celticwarriors.net/website/S3TCMedia/S3TCExamples/dWallB1.jpg

Having the master is awsome, these variations i can make in a couple of hours. If i had only the variation, than i have to make them all from scratch.


As far as the skylines, i could see if there is an UT2003/UT2004 master texture i can use ,and redraw it to an Unreal 1 version.


This also could be possible for other textures, though i asume i have to built most of the textures from scratch. But i am convinced that in some 3 months i must be able to come up with some 50 or maybe 200 textures if all goes a bit well.


But most of the techniques i still have to master, some techniques i even have not found out yet at all, no clue how they did it lol.
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[StalwartUK]

Just make sure that the textures end up looking like the originals because that's one of my main complaints with the original S3TC textures .

Prehaps for test/viewing purporses you should focus on all the textures in a single map (i.e. DMDeck16) so that people will be able to see what the textures (and the map) look like without any odd ones out .

[DieHard SCWS]

I never planned to alter Unreal in any way, the goal is to to re-create the textures excact as possible only with much higher detail.


I already planned to delete a bunch of S3TC textures that do not relate to Unreal at all, like the airducts in DmSinfonia, they are not just ugly, they do not represent the original textures at all. S3TC or not, they are out !!


And yes the complete new textures, i definatelly want to here comments on whats good or bad about them.


At start i tried to focus on one single map, but that is unduable, i still need to learn how to create the textures from scratch, doing one map would cover all techniques, that could take a year or years.


First i do all the textures that have master S3TC versions already as described in the post above.


Than i will work on simple but important textures like the elevator floors and the most used box like in DmDeck16 and all the doors.


In between i will also work on all the signs, those are some 50 textures that could be made pretty easelly. In between i will also see if i can replace the airducks by temporarelly textures that at least will give a better look than the plain horrible ones that you can see now.


After that i will start replacing the more complex textures. But always keep in mind, that if a texture does not look what its suposed to look, it can always be updated on later shedule, if i master the techniques better.


In any case it was never my intention to alter Unreal, just to try get the higher quality versions from the original textures


Unreal is and will stay Unreal
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[Hyper]

Just make sure that the textures end up looking like the originals because that's one of my main complaints with the original S3TC textures .

Prehaps for test/viewing purporses you should focus on all the textures in a single map (i.e. DMDeck16) so that people will be able to see what the textures (and the map) look like without any odd ones out .

You will always end with textures that are at least slightly different than the original ones. I had the same thought when I installed the S3TC textures, but now I am used to them, I never want to go back to those ugly blurry low-res textures.

The old textures were nice for 640x480 resolutions, but now almost everyone runs with Radeons or GeForces it's time for the next generation textures.

[Smirftsch]

good news, which can help you soon i hope - it seems to be possible to create texture packages with the new unrealed from unreal2 engine. if you dont have it, its contained in the free unreal2 runtime, located somewhere at epic... - so it should make it much more easy to create them. Possible is dxt1, dxt3 and dxt5 - dxt5 would be best of course, but in ued only dxt1 is displayed correctly - for opengl everything is possible. Will have to make more tests, for kerilk its working great he says - for me, i have currently some problems loading the textures when added into a map... Await more info in the next days

[DieHard SCWS]

but in ued only dxt1 is displayed correctly

By that you only mean dtx3 and dtx5 are displayed incorrectly in the editor, but still can be added and worked with.

Because i asume i don't really need them displayed properly, there is no need to see them, i only need to add them and being able to change settings like DrawScale.


Is that what you mean ?


But all together it sounds cool , cause what i understand its a single working tool, you do not need the complete game, that would be great if so.


Because at the end, it should be possible for any mapper to also create S3TC textures for their own maps. And not a situation that mappers have to ask others all the time to convert textures for them.
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