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Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

UT now belongs to the "old" Unreal as well. Supporting it for OpenGL and Sound its time to put up a board now.

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ZeaLitY
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Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by ZeaLitY »

Hey all (and greets to Leo TCK, Delacroix, gopostal, etc.)

Some prototypes were acquired as part of the Hidden Palace deluge, and I've been combing through them for any unique music (one UC proto, two UCII protos, one Unreal II Xbox port proto, and a Dreamcast UT port proto). Sadly, a Benny Hill theme OGG on Unreal II's Xbox proto was the only unique item found.

However, I noticed on the Dreamcast soundtrack (including the finished retail version's soundtrack) that additional instrumentation seems to be present in "Go Down". I haven't had a chance to investigate the other songs, yet (and can't for a bit; traveling for work). But I immediately wondered if maybe the Dreamcast Unreal Tournament songs used downmixed versions of the full quadraphonic/multichannel tracker files that were first brought up in a BeyondUnreal thread several years ago. Sadly, the thread creator deleted the body of his post: https://forums.beyondunreal.com/threads ... ks.187900/

I wanted to post here in case anyone can verify. I saw where I had posted in 2009 in that thread trying to successfully play or rip the quadraphonic tracks to make downmixed versions myself, but I guess I never succeeded; I can't find any evidence of the final output on my computer or my UT soundtrack collections. I also immediately wondered if maybe Unreal songs also have this support, and just haven't been properly investigated. So, just wanted to throw this out there in case anyone can take a look. Here is the Go Down proof:

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Leo T_C_K
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by Leo T_C_K »

I didn't see this yet but its kind of funny now they got exclusive protos while before they were hosting often the wrong repacks and everything of Unreal protos without as much as acknolwedging where it came from. So those are console only builds, no ibm pc executables?

Also the benny hill music was on the normal xbox unreal 2 release already. Its too bad they didn't get any of the pc betas because a lot of content is still missing and people who had the discs were far in between especially due to legend's closure and handover of every developer's data.

I wonder if the dreamcast disc has more of actual unr files that can work on the pc version. Does it?

edit: I can't check this myself and I'd rather not waste the banddwith so I'm curious how many actual working unr files are on the dreamcast disc.

As for the multichannel files I don't have them, but we know about all kind of hidden patterns some of which were restored for the asp pack by yrex etc.
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by Leo T_C_K »

I'm still waiting for this project to surface one day too:
https://ericchyn.weebly.com/user-interf ... -work.html

yes it was for PSX2 still strangely enough...some of my contacts told me of this when they worked on the game.

I believe the guy himself (Eric Chyn) hasn't replied to me though whether he has it or not - the other guys didn't -. Maybe someone else could try.
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by Victor Delacroix »

Leo T_C_K wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:04 pm I'm still waiting for this project to surface one day too:
https://ericchyn.weebly.com/user-interf ... -work.html

yes it was for PSX2 still strangely enough...some of my contacts told me of this when they worked on the game.

I believe the guy himself (Eric Chyn) hasn't replied to me though whether he has it or not - the other guys didn't -. Maybe someone else could try.
Unreal Tournament: Assault? ANOTHER alias for Unreal Championship, or UT2003, I reckon? Judging from the presence of that Skaarj mug, reminds me of UT2004's.

No wonder this got canned though. I don't think UE2 fits PS2's specs much...
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by Leo T_C_K »

Victor Delacroix wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:09 pm
Leo T_C_K wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:04 pm I'm still waiting for this project to surface one day too:
https://ericchyn.weebly.com/user-interf ... -work.html

yes it was for PSX2 still strangely enough...some of my contacts told me of this when they worked on the game.

I believe the guy himself (Eric Chyn) hasn't replied to me though whether he has it or not - the other guys didn't -. Maybe someone else could try.
Unreal Tournament: Assault? ANOTHER alias for Unreal Championship, or UT2003, I reckon? Judging from the presence of that Skaarj mug, reminds me of UT2004's.

No wonder this got canned though. I don't think UE2 fits PS2's specs much...
They scaled it down. It was different and had exclusive content. All the levels had to be remade, some of the Digitalo guys that worked on Devastation worked on that port and indeed it had the Skaarj before UT2004 was released.

So yea it lacked a ton of detail it was the port of UT2 that happened during 2003. But it was functional, just rough at the edges and not completely finished. I spoke to one of the LDs on the project sadly he didn't have the levels or anything of it anymore. As for who it was, it was either Phil Cole or umm...that other guy. I can't remember now. But he was also involved with Devastation.
EDIT:
Ah it was Ben Golus who told me most about ot:
We had some levels running at 60fps on the PS2, but most ran around 30.

> Don't have much I can say about it beyond it was
> going to have ports of the original levels and a few custom ones. But most
> of the original UT2k3 levels were way too big to have ever worked on the
> PS2 so it would have been a pale imitation of the original.
> >>> In general there are a lot more games cancelled that people never hear
> about. I know a few people who for the first 5+ years they worked in the
> game industry didn't work on a single released or even announced game.
Last edited by Leo T_C_K on Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Victor Delacroix
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by Victor Delacroix »

If WE ever get that THING...
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Leo T_C_K
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by Leo T_C_K »

Victor Delacroix wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:27 pm If WE ever get that THING...
Maybe, just edited my last post with more info though.

Also...afaik I haven't spoken to Eric so maybe he has something? Perhaps my message bounced, volny.cz had a lot of domains reject the stuff or w/e. So someone should definitely give it a try.

EDIT:
Also notice the gametypes in the ladder. It says RA. I'm trying to get Ben to answer me if it was Rocket Arena or something else. If he can recall.
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by ZeaLitY »

Yep, it came from a large cache that was sold several months ago. Most of the "prototypes" were review copies sent to magazines and so on just a few days before the games went gold, so I guess that's why there was nothing special. There might be some sound effect differences or scrapped effects on the Unreal Championship discs, but that's it so far.

Leo, you are interested in the maps, right? I can grab those and put them here. Just let me know what else you would need (UTX files etc.)
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by Leo T_C_K »

The regular DC disc had one unr map that worked on the PC version iirc. The rest not. Because they were in their special format. I'm hoping that this DC disc might have more of the unr files intact. Just check if it has .unr maps overall. If yes, upload just those nothing else, it should be enough.

EDIT: Also to get back to the PS2 UT2 project, I just got some more answers. The RA gametype could have been rocket arena but also they had a plan for some special game type. This was probably not yet implemented by the time it was canned. That's it in short. Ben only ran around few levels solo he was brought in pretty late in developement so it didn't take much before the game was cancelled and he was freed of his duties.

The PS2 hardware build they had was pretty bare overall.
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by ZeaLitY »

Attaching both UNRs present. DM-Barricade-DC and DOM-Hood-DC.
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by Leo T_C_K »

I don't recall if barricade was present as unr I think only the hood map was...but those are not really the maps I was after hmm...I suppose there's a slim chance the non unr maps might work (well you might want to try as a test to copy them to UT rename the extension to unr and see if they run).

I mean its better to have the originals than those shoddy renamed RA map parts with random pickups that have been floating around as they are not accurate at all.

I'll try it in a bit if possible and compare any differences.

EDIT: I can't go to the other machine right now anymore might be tomorrow when I try it.

Either way, some more tidbits about the PS2 UT2. They had multiple versions including the PC running version, Ben remembers the real hardware one that he used to run his and other levels. Not everything was functional on that build. They had like only two functional weapons and some working AI that he didn't even use. Most of the developement/models were not even compiled into it at that time. Perhaps only for the PC version of it. So kind of similar story to Unreal PSX because the PSX hardware build also wasn't 100 percent.
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by ZeaLitY »

Here are all DAT files too: https://mega.nz/file/1Bg2RLbD#OYC-OetUg ... Ws-WUY_6D0

Let me know if you have issues with that 7z (for bandwidth, I basically used the ridiculous ultra compression options)
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by Leo T_C_K »

What is the size though? mega won't tell me upfront as its also reliant only on javascript meaning I can use it only with yet another laptop and it will instantly load it into the browser's memory which is not good. But you could try telling me if they are runnable or not. I will try to compare the differences when I can later if there are any.
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by Leo T_C_K »

Thanks a lot, with that I should be able to download it anywhere.
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by Leo T_C_K »

I tried the unr maps only so far, apart from slight time difference which might have been a time zone they are absolutely identical to the regular dc ones. I didn't have acess to the other machine for a while now so I will download/try the dc dat files at later point. However the unr ones are really no different from regular dreamcast ut. They don't use music tracks also because they are tuned to the cd music i guess.
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Re: Multichannel tracker support - in just UT songs, or also Unreal?

Post by ZeaLitY »

I checked out the quadraphonic tracks again, and for Go Down, the additional 2 tracks are just some very, very basic instrumental backing (which reminds me why I never bothered in the first place). So I now almost have to conclude that Go Down, as it appears on Dreamcast, was a different tracker file (maybe one that Alexander Brandon tweaked further before release).

Organic also sounds different at one point:
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