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Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

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Leo T_C_K
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Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Leo T_C_K »

https://forums.beyondunreal.com/threads ... st-2621599

repost/edit from this:
I've just looked into the Mobile Forces game deeper. The game build and everything about it is with no doubt THE Unreal Warfare engine, the original one where UW started on and Unreal 2 followed and this explains also the missing link in MP developement when it's clear to me that Retro had the UW license from this point.

It took ages for Mobile Forces to come out but its engine is really the missing link between unreal engine "1" and "2"...
Sure it's a bit of a crude game but they didn't even bother to remove some references like staticmesh replace function has default "AlienGeorge"....(this is because the mockup mesh in the engine uses that texture)
And there are functions in the editor that were removed from later engine versions. This is truly an unique piece.

This is the first time I'm trying this out but this proves I was right in my arguments...


[URL=http://unrealtexture.com/Hosted/Leo_T_C_K/newstuff/mfedscreens.rar]MFEDscreens[/URL]

Those are screenshots I took of various differences/interesting things. It's too many to show separately so it's in the archive...

EDIT: That wikipedia says it's "unreal engine 1" is bogus...that stuff was invented by marketing liars like Mark Rein who ran the business at the time. I mean guys like him were actively lying about the unreal developement, saying it became an urban legend that it was worked on for about 4 years or so...but that's exactly what happened. Yet he called it a lie. The game had about three separate stages which could be made into three separate games...

Then he lies aboiut the "six months" thing about Steve Polge. Bullshit. Polge was already there at least since january 1997. So in the august interview that's more than six months. SIX MONTHS. What's up with the SIX MONTHS thing. Even the conspirators in Deus Ex keep saying that and I was told that same thing too before I had to "disappear" from somewhere years ago...oh my god the illimunati link is strong here....

Either way the explanation cannot be that he counted six months only when they introduced the new unrealscript and had to re-design the game. Because that doesn't add up. But it was almost six months by then since John Anderson left the team...hmm

I'M SURE THERE'S A GREAT CONSPIRACY BEHIND THIS...ERHM

SIX MONTHS.

Last edited by Leo T_C_K on Fri May 20, 2016 8:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Hellkeeper »

Old men. Running the world.

This is fascinating. Where does this version of the engine stand compared to the one in the UTX beta (2001). If you say it's still UE1, it should be slightly older?
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Leo T_C_K
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Leo T_C_K »

The UTX Beta is from October 2001. This is like early 2001 engine. I'm not actually saying it's Unreal Engine 1, that's what they are saying. But they're wrong. It's really something in between. The Unreal Warfare engine is what this was called before they invented the whole UEngine 2 and tried to reqrite history with that. In fact one of the ut2kx betas I believe the beta demo still uses the concent of hardware brushes seen in leftovers in this mobile forces editor...but those things are not there in the unreal championship alpha (utx beta).

If you look at very early unreal 2 screenshots they seem to use the same "filtering" like mobile forces, etcetera and the models just fit into the general design like the earliest skaarj mesh for unreal 2 that wasn't recovered (the one in the e3 alpha is already a later design).
And various unreal 2 textures featue leftover screenshots, this also fits in with the 2000 unreal technology demo trailer that was released, not very far from this although that still used botpack weapons. 

This puts the height of this engine really somewhere truly early 2001 or going from very late 2000. But they already started the Warfare project by then and developers were happily using it by large numbers.

Don't forget the Unreal 2 alpha is actually just a couple of hundred engine version later than mobile forces. So closest to this is the Unreal 2 alpha and the ut2kx beta demo(s) in practice.

EDIT:
SIX MONTHS
Last edited by Leo T_C_K on Fri May 20, 2016 8:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Hellkeeper »

Interesting. I remember seing videos of a weird hybrid between UE1 and UE2 with UT99 weapons and characters but UE2's terrains, some static-meshes and particle systems.

I have the impression UE 2.0, which was not coded from the ground up, was simply the result of progressive additions, extensions and rewriting of parts of UE 1.0. Which explains why we have many different versions spanning the entire continuum between the two. TO my knowledge, UWarfare is simply a name which was taken because it sounded cool, but which was dropped at some time during the development of UE1 into UE2. In this sense, it would not be a lie to call this engine UE2, simply a retroactive use of the definitive name.
EDIT:
SIX MONTHS

:D I love this.
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Leo T_C_K
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Leo T_C_K »

Except I never liked the designation UE1 and such. It wasn't there until like much later. Everyone just called it the unreal engine. Then there was the Warfare engine. Only later they tried to rewrite the history. The Warfare engine was called after the main game they developed at the time at Epic, Unreal Warfare. That game never ended up to be released and its assets instead surfaces in ut2k4 etc and it ultimately became the gears of war, which was the "UE3" already.
But yes, the developement goes like that and many of the teams branched off their own version of the engine, so there's even more differences here and there. Some teams stuck to the core and didn't renew their licenses, others had to keep up with "times", which in many cases only hurted the projects concerned. There's hardly anything wrong with Mobile Forces because it stuck to the engine they've been given to work with. With Unreal 2 that wasn't the case and it showed. They had to constantly keep up, reducing the game quality as it went and stupid decisions from the powers that be...
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by []KAOS[]Casey »

you do realize that all the engines from U1 to UT3 were all incremental builds right? there's not exactly a missing link. warfare is just some arbitrary build number range.

also, supposedly the unreal warfare engine/game was leaked and can be played with the demo map it's got. I think I saw something on youtube about it
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Leo T_C_K »

you do realize that all the engines from U1 to UT3 were all incremental builds right? there's not exactly a missing link. warfare is just some arbitrary build number range.

also, supposedly the unreal warfare engine/game was leaked and can be played with the demo map it's got. I think I saw something on youtube about it
That was a quite late incarnation of unreal warfare. That was just when it was shifting into gears of war..

Still even if you count it just as arbitrary number range, this period that mobile force used was hardly used anywhere else, therefore it's more unique and seeing these features it indeed is. Mobile Forces itself borrows heavily from what Unreal Warfare was, except this doesn't take place in the "Unreal" universe and it doesn't really have class-based separations. Otherwise it's pretty much similar including use of vehicles..
Last edited by Leo T_C_K on Sat May 21, 2016 5:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Hellkeeper »

That was a quite late incarnation of unreal warfare. That was just when it was shifting into gears of war..

Any detail about this? I was under the impression that Unreal Warfare actually ended up being Unreal Championship, with the planned vehicles and such.
Last edited by Hellkeeper on Sat May 21, 2016 8:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Leo T_C_K »

That was a quite late incarnation of unreal warfare. That was just when it was shifting into gears of war..

Any detail about this? I was under the impression that Unreal Warfare actually ended up being Unreal Championship, with the planned vehicles and such.
No no no, Unreal Championship was developed alongside Unreal 2 and Unreal Warfare, both having branched off with their engine/features. Unreal Warfare was purely Epic thing and DE had nothing to do with it. Unreal Championship was purely DE until later in developement.
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Hellkeeper »

Ooooh, right. So Epic cancelled its Warfare title and then got its hands a half-finished UC from DE to develop it into UT2003 later.
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Leo T_C_K »

Ooooh, right. So Epic cancelled its Warfare title and then got its hands a half-finished UC from DE to develop it into UT2003 later.
Kind of, Warfare was still in developement by that point though. There's even a leak of a late unreal warfare demo out there but it's practically already gears of war and isn't that interesting anymore.

But ut2003 and championship were both DE thing, in case of ut2003 epic had more active involvement to begin with and epic was responsible for finishing that game up.


EDIT:
http://www.shacknews.com/article/11799/epics-unreal-warfare just some random news from ways ago, lol at Cliff's bare response.

Also:


However it was never call of duty-like game despite the looks or whatever that guy says. That's what everyone assumes. But try to play mobile force, even that doesn't play as slow as you'd imagine and that is less sci-fi than unreal warfare was.

EDIT2: This is the GDC video, this was still Unreal Warfare though this already changed from the earlier stuff that I personally think was better, but not yet GoW style...
Last edited by Leo T_C_K on Sun May 22, 2016 6:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

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EDIT2: This is the GDC video, this was still Unreal Warfare though this already changed from the earlier stuff that I personally think was better, but not yet GoW style...
Ah, I remember seing this one and I searched for it for a long time, never able to get my hands back on it, thank you so much!

This one is fascinating because you can see that apart from the character, every single one of these assets was eventually packed with UT2003/2004, meshes, textures and sounds (and even the KnockHelmet scripted action). The most surprising in my opinion is UT2004's sniper rifle's scope!

That sheds a lof of new lights on things I was wondering about. Thanks a lot for that. :)

EDIT: looking at this video, it's clear that the colours are duller than the should be because the meshes are intact in UT200X with their textures and it doesn't look so grey and brown. This video already has the trademark GOW poop-filter all over it. However it's clear that there was a real tendency already towards these kind of colours and it's the exact same palette as in GOW, grey, brown, dull red and various shades of gritty metal. Retroactively, I'm terribly thankfull that instead of having to swallow this in 2002/2003, we got a few years worth of unapologetic colours and bright cartooney shades. Maybe this has to do with DE's work on DE? At any rate, I'm glad we had UC/UT2003 and their brother UT2004 with the tone mapping they had. Comparatively, they look so bright, joyful and fun. :)
Last edited by Hellkeeper on Sun May 22, 2016 9:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Leo T_C_K »

That's what I'm sad about. I think to be honest that ut2004 took it too far with the cartoony wash out feel. And this was still more colorful than what gow turned out to be.
But yes those assets turned out in ut2003 bonuspacks and ut2004.
Last edited by Leo T_C_K on Sun May 22, 2016 10:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

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This one is fascinating because you can see that apart from the character, every single one of these assets was eventually packed with UT2003/2004, meshes, textures and sounds (and even the KnockHelmet scripted action). The most surprising in my opinion is UT2004's sniper rifle's scope!
Incidentally, the soldier character model was included in one or two third party UE2 games for some reason.

[img][/img]
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Leo T_C_K »

Which one was it? So far I discovered upon reading comments etc that XIII has a unremoved title "Unreal Warfare" in it in a taskbar. It's be interesting to gather all this and try to find out which one of the engine versions can open the loose unreal warfare maps we got. Even thiough we will miss resources for sure..
Last edited by Leo T_C_K on Mon May 23, 2016 12:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

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Splinter Cell: Pandora Tomorrow and Brothers in Arms. There might be more, just search for "warcoggrunt" on Google.

Edit: It might also be called testsoldier.psk.
Last edited by AlCapowned on Mon May 23, 2016 1:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Leo T_C_K »

Compared to wikipedia this is at least more accurate:
http://www.unrealtexture.com/Unreal/Downloads/3DEditing/UnrealEd/Tutorials/unrealwiki-offline/unreal-engine-versions.html

But it lists 500- as unrealengine 2, yet mobile forces is listed under unrealengine 1 and I confirmed myself it is build 500 something. (speaking of that I'm not sure where but I saw it somewhere in the files and no i'm not talking about the firstrun thing in ini as tht got overwrote by the patch)
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by gregaras. »

In interview one of Mobile Forces programmers told they used Unreal Engine version 436: https://web.archive.org/web/20020605041 ... ileforces/
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Re: Mobile Forces is using the original Unreal Warfare engine..

Post by Leo T_C_K »

Well, I would have thought logging in here wouldn't work but what do I know...

That article simply means they started on version 436, I have (had) another article, a bigger one in a computer magazine where they said they used whatever was the first version of the engine that Epic implemented the hardware brushes/staticmeshes on and went on from there. Without mentioning the engine version number however I am positive that this is the case.

This might be a rare appearance from me here and maybe one of my only ones.

Warfare did start around that time after all Unreal 2 started on at least version 400 in the first place but went on..

Since the times I posted here there was a demo version of UEngine 2 Unreal Warfare recovered/posted btw.
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