Oldunreal Forums - Bump mapping support?

Hellkeeper Oldunreal MasterPoster Offline Posts: 1821 France Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #20 - 06/26/12 at 16:41:47 Smirftsch wrote on 06/26/12 at 13:08:24: Can it be done? Sure. Can I do it? Not at the moment, not the time, not the health, not the money it would require me to have the needed time. It's always about you isn't it, don't you care about our feelings ?
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Smirftsch YaBB Administrator Offline Posts: 5488 at home Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #21 - 06/26/12 at 18:00:06 I love your refreshing way of seeing things. Nope, actually I'm pure egoist.
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iLikeTheUDK Senior Member Offline I knew that Netanyahu would realize that too... Posts: 395 Tel Mond, Israel Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #22 - 06/27/12 at 06:39:08 Nobody likes egoists...
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Smirftsch YaBB Administrator Offline Posts: 5488 at home Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #23 - 06/27/12 at 12:08:50 iLikeTheUDK wrote on 06/27/12 at 06:39:08: Nobody likes egoists... Most of the time I like me
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iLikeTheUDK Senior Member Offline I knew that Netanyahu would realize that too... Posts: 395 Tel Mond, Israel Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #24 - 06/27/12 at 13:04:18 Yup, the only people who like egoists are the egoists themselves...
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Hellkeeper Oldunreal MasterPoster Offline Posts: 1821 France Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #25 - 06/28/12 at 11:15:34 Achievement unlocked : Signalman. Derail a thread in one sentence.
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Turboman God Member Offline I love YaBB 1G - SP1! Posts: 768 Amsterdam Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #26 - 06/30/12 at 11:39:50 Then lets put it back on its track! Bumpmapping is soooooo 2001! we need to stay with the times with dx11 tesselation
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roland285 Senior Member Offline nintendo runs out of ideas..... Posts: 313	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #27 - 06/30/12 at 12:59:46 somehing more simple: can it be done so we can configure the direction in UED of the real time shadows we have right now? this would make the shadows look way more realistic in outdoor areas.
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iLikeTheUDK Senior Member Offline I knew that Netanyahu would realize that too... Posts: 395 Tel Mond, Israel Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #28 - 06/30/12 at 15:34:30 ...Wait... Was bumpmapping used in games already in 2001? I thought the first games to use it were released in 2004 - maybe 2003/2 at the earliest. And did any device except for PCs support it already in this time?
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Turboman

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Re: Bump mapping support?
Reply #29 - 06/30/12 at 15:45:40

iLikeTheUDK wrote on 06/30/12 at 15:34:30:

...Wait...

Was bumpmapping used in games already in 2001? I thought the first games to use it were released in 2004 - maybe 2003/2 at the earliest. And did any device except for PCs support it already in this time?

Almost all x-box games around then had bumpmapping, probably most noticeable was halo which came around 2001.
On the pc even older games like tomb raider, outcast, battlezone, operation flashpoint, and giants citizen kabuto were among the early adopters.
Most of them were handled in software/CPU or specific Matrox hardware though, and giants required atleast a geforce 256 card.

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iLikeTheUDK

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Re: Bump mapping support?
Reply #30 - 06/30/12 at 17:51:39

No offense, but I think you're making the once common mistake that I thought to have passed from the world, of mistaking Bump Mapping to Specular Mapping. If Halo: Combat Evolved had bump mapping, it was probably just for the environment maps. The first game in the Halo series that I know for sure that it had bump mapping and per-pixel lighting was Halo 2. Unreal Engine couldn't have been so outdated...It would surely add Bump Mapping around 2001 if it was common back then. And as far as I know, Halo: CE came out in 2002, not 2001; And that was also the year the Xbox was released in North America. As far as I know, it was only released in 2001 in Japan.

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GreatEmerald

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Re: Bump mapping support?
Reply #31 - 06/30/12 at 17:59:28

Hmm, true, bumpmapping was introduced, on the OpenGL side, in version 1.3, which was released in 2001. On the D3D side, it was introduced in D3D6, although I'm not sure when that was released (if with DX6, then it was back in 1998!). And apparently OpenGL was used in Windows before they created D3D, that's something I never knew...

By the way, theoretically you can set up Unreal II to use them in some specific situations, as it allows you to access low-level D3D functionality in Golem Studio. Quite interesting.

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iLikeTheUDK

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Re: Bump mapping support?
Reply #32 - 06/30/12 at 19:07:53

D3D6 was released with DX6. But maybe graphics processors were not powerful enough to run it, because if they could, Unreal and Half-Life would have bump mapping naturally implemented as to keep up with modern graphics. And we'll probably be well after the time that game engines started implementing true global illumination in actual real time...and probably most engines would have turbulence simulation by now...

...lol, Turboman, looks like you can probably receive the Signalman "achievement" as well, if there was such achievement...

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Smirftsch

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Re: Bump mapping support?
Reply #33 - 07/01/12 at 12:05:38

it can be clearly seen that they wanted to implement it back then, since already the 224 code contained:
UTexture* BumpMap; // Bump map to illuminate this texture with.

Unfortunately it never was implemented then, not in UT, not in 226. Major reason for this was probably the step to UE2 and that they moved on from doing all stuff in the Engine to start doing things in the GPU.

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iLikeTheUDK Senior Member Offline I knew that Netanyahu would realize that too... Posts: 395 Tel Mond, Israel Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #34 - 07/01/12 at 12:50:51 And unfortunately, even if it was seen in later UE2 games, bump mapping was never seen in any game by Epic until the UE3 era. Also, I think Quake 3 was the first game that managed to (sorta) implement normal-mapped bump mapping. And I wonder why didn't Half-Life do it?
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Hellkeeper Oldunreal MasterPoster Offline Posts: 1821 France Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #35 - 07/01/12 at 13:45:24 Half-life was a Q2-based engine, with traces of Q1 code in places. Such things were not done without horrible performances until 2005/6, much later.
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iLikeTheUDK Senior Member Offline I knew that Netanyahu would realize that too... Posts: 395 Tel Mond, Israel Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #36 - 07/01/12 at 14:07:12 So you're saying, in other words, that, like I thought, video cards just weren't even half powerful enough to render bump mapping?
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Hellkeeper Oldunreal MasterPoster Offline Posts: 1821 France Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #37 - 07/01/12 at 16:05:08 Yes.
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iLikeTheUDK Senior Member Offline I knew that Netanyahu would realize that too... Posts: 395 Tel Mond, Israel Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #38 - 07/01/12 at 16:48:03 Well, kinda sad, since according to Tim Sweeney, CPUs could outrun GPUs, because there's no need to wait until features will be added; They could just be rendered via Software. ...Oh wait, CPUs weren't powerful enough back then as well. Shame.
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Hellkeeper Oldunreal MasterPoster Offline Posts: 1821 France Gender:	Re: Bump mapping support? Reply #39 - 07/02/12 at 09:07:01 GPUs and CPUs are not interchangeable chips linked to a different set of circuits. A GPU is much more efficient for graphical operations than a CPU, even if it is a bit slower.
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